Quote from Darthjt: "With the new amulets that will be released soon, there will be a whole new dimension to the game, that will change PvP forever! "
After Darthjt stated this, my brother and I started talking it over. Here was just the very first part of our conversation.......
Imagine this: A Storm Wizard that can heal almost as fast as Life, with crafted gear. It can hit you like a rock, and you can't kill them unless with a one hit ko.
A Myth that can take off your shields and can push a Judgement just about as hard as Balance, with Crafted gear.
A life that can hit just about as hard as Storm with Crafted gear.
An Ice with Storm, Fire or Balance that can hit you with whatever they want, after you get your -70 Ice Shields up in place.
A Fire Wizard that can use Earthquake just like a Myth Wizard does, and then hit you with Dragon the next round.
A Death Wizard that can ready with a hard hit, and then Skeleton Dragon.
A Balance that has Blades already to use for any school and can now use them with a secondary school, plus the schools blade for added hit.
We had lots of thoughts after this, but I will stop here...... So, I can see a whole new Wizard101 just around the corner....
Oh my goodness. Yes. PvP will be a challenge to adapt to when the new amulets come out. So many new, unfair tactics will be popping up everywhere - especially in 1v1 and 4v4. Think of these scenarios: with Life Amulet, life dispels = 1 power pip (along with any other kind of dispels), Crafted Rebirth TC will equal the 7 power pips instead of having to save full pips to rebirth (without the amulet, and if you're not life, crafted rebirth in this case) Pixie with 1 power pip, Satyr with 2 power pips (instead of 4 if you're not life). There is so many other things you can do too , especially with other schools you've trained such as Myth, and you can hit with earthquake (which you said) and all of the crafted level 48 spells TC (can be crafted from one of the crabs in Crustacean Empire) will be hitting us everywhere. Wow. I really hope these aren't carried over to the live realm. All of us will have to adapt all over again, just like we did with Critical when it came out, which I still believe should be removed from PvP. Sigh. I mean I don't mind if the realms are carried to the Live Realm, but just be restricted from PvP at the least... -ASF
oh no people will have to change there strategies!!!!! the world is gonna end!!!!!!!1 the apocolips is near!!!!!!!!!! give me a break.
i mean really! you will have to update your strategy a little bit to counter this, and do you realize this binifits PvE!!!!!!!! you are looking at the glass half empty, not half full. if you arent a serious pvper, this wont effect you, if you are a serious pvper, cirtainly you can creat a strategy to counter this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! dont be a pessimist for petes sake. you are only looking at the dark side of this. you make it sound like only the OPPOMENT can get this bonus THIS WILL BE HERE FOR ALL not just whom your facing. i bet that eventually you will give in and get it and try to rule pvp. in pve it lets you solo more easily, your low on health and you cast a dryad full power pips critical, that would heal you right up right?
like a previous poster said, you adapted to criticals, it only took a couple months, and you will adapt to these it might take longer, it might take shorter. and why should KI take out something that MILLIONS of people would enjoy, just because of a couple of people?
@Slammer111: in this post, we are talking about PvP, not PvE. and yes, some of us are serious PvP players. we don't need your sarcasm. Next time, you could be a little nicer with your choice of words, and be straight to the point and not downing people. ok, thanks.
@Slammer111: in this post, we are talking about PvP, not PvE. and yes, some of us are serious PvP players. we don't need your sarcasm. Next time, you could be a little nicer with your choice of words, and be straight to the point and not downing people. ok, thanks.
agreed, everyone posting on here pays a subscription for different reasons. 10 million people can't agree with any one thing and if you think differently you're just wrong. Expressing ones thoughts without being rude or obnoxious is usually a more effective way to debate. If the thread topic gets you that mad don't post it.
Okay, lets all calm down and take a few deep breaths!
This is not the end of the world, nor is it the end of PvP!
Actually, this will make PvP a lot more interesting and even more challenging than it already is!
Criticals did not ruin PvP!
Pets did not ruin PvP!
Celestian Gear did not ruin PvP!
So, there is no reason to think these amulets will ruin PvP either.
Yes, they will challenge you and make you think of new and better strategies! They will make you have to cover any and all schools. They do help healing, but with all the damage modifiers out there, it is not hard to one hit kill anyone, including Ice!!!
So, lets all take a deep breath and look forward to this awesome and new dynamic to the Wizard 101 Spiral!
@Slammer111: in this post, we are talking about PvP, not PvE. and yes, some of us are serious PvP players. we don't need your sarcasm. Next time, you could be a little nicer with your choice of words, and be straight to the point and not downing people. ok, thanks.
ok so here was my point, criticals are very common in pvp, people have gotten used to them, others arent being overpowered because they dont know how they work (even though diego taught them) the same thing is here. i bet every person complaining, when they actually get the amulet, will love it in pvp and pve. and what will that make you? i dont mean to be rude(mostly) but you word choices, your "tone" made it really seem like you were trying to twist the facts to get people to agree with you, and that really ticks me off.
Okay, lets all calm down and take a few deep breaths!
This is not the end of the world, nor is it the end of PvP!
It depends on how these amulets are received in PvP. I've played this game a long time and when there is a problem in PvP, it does have a negative effect. Chain stunning was a HUGE problem in 2009. A lot of people stopped doing ranked matches because of it. This could happen again. Or this could be something that a lot of people use. We don't know.
@Slammer111: in this post, we are talking about PvP, not PvE. and yes, some of us are serious PvP players. we don't need your sarcasm. Next time, you could be a little nicer with your choice of words, and be straight to the point and not downing people. ok, thanks.
ok so here was my point, criticals are very common in pvp, people have gotten used to them, others arent being overpowered because they dont know how they work (even though diego taught them) the same thing is here. i bet every person complaining, when they actually get the amulet, will love it in pvp and pve. and what will that make you? i dont mean to be rude(mostly) but you word choices, your "tone" made it really seem like you were trying to twist the facts to get people to agree with you, and that really ticks me off.
Chill out. PvP is only PART of the game, and it's ignorant people like you trying to start things on the message boards where EVERYONE can read this. There are mixed opinions over the new amulets, and you may be right, maybe I will like the amulets and maybe I won't. Like Roland says, if you're gonna keep going on and on about something - get off the message boards and let's take this to the arena, and we'll see who's whinning then..
First, the idea behind the Amulets is a wonderful idea. That said...
I am what some would describe as a min-max video game player: I like to maximize damage output, and minimize incoming damage. With this in mind, in the Teas Realm, I retrained my Lrgrndary Ice in Life School up to Satyr, which allowed me to heal both myself and others at will, with the speed that only a Life Wizard could previously do it.
Co-operative play is perhaps the most defining aspect of this game. With the introduction of the Amulets as is, this social quality will most likely become something long time players will reminisce about. "Remember when we all needed to work together?"
With pets that cast Spritely at seemingly random times, and Rings and Athames that give incoming and outgoing boosts to healing already in Live Play, allowing the Amulets to have a constant effect will change the way the game is played and the interaction between players in a decidedly non-positive way. ------------
I played 15 PvP matches on the Test Realm, won 13 and lost 2. The two I lost was before I re-trained in the Life School. Once I could "spam heal," I had no fear of losing.
I am an Ice Wizard. Here are some numbers:
1) Total Resists to everything: 45% (gear = 37%, and pet = 8%) 2) regular Fortify: 15%, treasure Fortify: 20% 3) This gives me a grand total of 60% to 65% resist to everything. 4) Tower Shield: -50% to incoming damage.
In short, the Shield cuts damage in half, then my resistance and Fortify cuts the remaining damage by more than half. So I effectively take no damage at all.
1) Ring: 21% incoming healing, 20% outgoing healing 2) Athame: 21% incoming healing, 20% outgoing healing 3) Grand total healing to self: +82%
With these healing boosts in mind... 1) Satyr 860 + 82% = 1709 healing to self 2) Pixie or Fairy 400 +82% = 795 3) Sprite 30 + 270 over 3 rnds + 82% = 99 + 596 over 3 rnds
As an Ice Wizard with such high resistance, I can fully heal after a Storm Wizard hits me with a fully loaded Leviathan. So my strategy became: blade as able, Fortify, Tower Shield, treasure Gargantuan on Snow Angel, and HEAL. Once I was at full power pips, I had tons of blades and cast 2 Snow Angels back to back each doing over 4000 damage per Angel (including the first hit and the following 3 rounds). With the match over, I still had full health.
As soon as I switched over to Life, I couldn't be beat. :-( No more challenge.
Of course I went up against another Ice Wizard once, and we both "spam healed." The match lasted 40 minutes before she got bored, gave up, and fled. It could have easily lasted for an hour or more, as we both had Reshuffle. And in PvP, no mana is consumed in the casting of any spells, so there was no real time limit, and no real end in sight.
And we both had the Life Amulet. ------------
Then there is Team PvP, which I admittedly do not play due to the tactics of Earthquake (EQ) Stun.
With the introduction of these Amulets, this tactic will be easily abused... Until, of course, KI fixes it so that EQ no longer removes Stun Blocks.
But as it stands...
In order to have a regular 42 Level Spell in your main deck (meaning non-treasure: Hydra, Centaur, Earthquake, Wraith, Helephant, Colossus, or Stormzilla), you will have to use your training points all the way in a non-primary school. If you do this, it is commonly referred to as your "secondary school," because you really don't have any training points left over to significantly train in a third school.
I can see a 4v4 team being made up of Storm-Myth, Ice-Myth, and Myth-Whatever, with the 4th player as you so choose but with Myth secondary.
1st Round) Stun All 2nd Round) EQ, Stun All 3rd Round) EQ, Lord or Giant 4th Round) EQ, Giant or Lord And so on....
Add Treasure Cards, and this pattern can easily be used. It all depends on who gets to cast the First Stun All spell. ------------
I have a few ideas that could allow the use of power pips for off-school spells, but take away the constant effect that the Amulets currently provide.
Possible Solutions
1) Amulet gives 3 or 4 Auras that each last 4 rnds giving access to power pips to a specific alternate school.
2) Amulet gives 4 or 5 blades that each give access to power pips to a specific alternate school.
3) Amulet gives 5 or 6 Sun School type spells that can be attached to another spell (like Keen Eyes or Gargantuan) which converts the spell into one's main school, thus giving access to power pips for that spell. However, once attached, no other Sun type spell can be attached.
4) And this is just a wild idea: A polymorph spell that transforms you into a different school for 6 rounds, but doesn't change your spell deck like the other Polymorph spells do.
There is a trade off in each of these ideas, which lends a more balanced application of the idea to access power pips for an alternate school. Example, while the Life School Aura is active, you can't have a Fortify, Amplify, or Vengeance Aura; the Blades are expended upon use; the Sun type spells are permanently attached for the duration of the battle; yet they are all returned upon a Reshuffle. ------------
Molly SilverRiver --Legnendary Balance (Ice to Tower Shield, Death up to Feint), Commander Digby DreamCloud --Legnendary Ice (Death up to Feint), Warlord
@glitter10266 darthjt basically said what i was TRYING to say, but better worded and frankly a lot nicer, and, we, like everyone else here, are expressing our opinion, how it comes across... thats another matter
First, the idea behind the Amulets is a wonderful idea. That said...
I am what some would describe as a min-max video game player: I like to maximize damage output, and minimize incoming damage. With this in mind, in the Teas Realm, I retrained my Lrgrndary Ice in Life School up to Satyr, which allowed me to heal both myself and others at will, with the speed that only a Life Wizard could previously do it.
I am the same way, min-max player, however, I disagree with you and even on your Ice, I can beat you with multiple character classes, so hate to burst your strong bubble, but it can be done!
Co-operative play is perhaps the most defining aspect of this game. With the introduction of the Amulets as is, this social quality will most likely become something long time players will reminisce about. "Remember when we all needed to work together?"
With pets that cast Spritely at seemingly random times, and Rings and Athames that give incoming and outgoing boosts to healing already in Live Play, allowing the Amulets to have a constant effect will change the way the game is played and the interaction between players in a decidedly non-positive way. ------------
Who's decidedly non-positive way? This does not mean that people wont work together anymore, actually it means people might work more together. There is no for sure way to tell, but it does mean an easier time for those that love to play solo!
I played 15 PvP matches on the Test Realm, won 13 and lost 2. The two I lost was before I re-trained in the Life School. Once I could "spam heal," I had no fear of losing.
Did you play the same people, was it always random? Did you play the 2 people you lost to after you changed up and then won?
I am an Ice Wizard. Here are some numbers:
1) Total Resists to everything: 45% (gear = 37%, and pet = 8%) 2) regular Fortify: 15%, treasure Fortify: 20% 3) This gives me a grand total of 60% to 65% resist to everything. 4) Tower Shield: -50% to incoming damage.
In short, the Shield cuts damage in half, then my resistance and Fortify cuts the remaining damage by more than half. So I effectively take no damage at all.
1) Ring: 21% incoming healing, 20% outgoing healing 2) Athame: 21% incoming healing, 20% outgoing healing 3) Grand total healing to self: +82%
With these healing boosts in mind... 1) Satyr 860 + 82% = 1709 healing to self 2) Pixie or Fairy 400 +82% = 795 3) Sprite 30 + 270 over 3 rnds + 82% = 99 + 596 over 3 rnds
Good numbers and I agree with them, you are not telling me anything new! What you failed to realize though, is most people take time to come up with a good strategy and as it is now, most people fail when it comes to beating Ice without the amulets, which is why people have been complaining that Ice is overpowered now. Yet, I assure you, I can show you how you are easily defeated!
As an Ice Wizard with such high resistance, I can fully heal after a Storm Wizard hits me with a fully loaded Leviathan. So my strategy became: blade as able, Fortify, Tower Shield, treasure Gargantuan on Snow Angel, and HEAL. Once I was at full power pips, I had tons of blades and cast 2 Snow Angels back to back each doing over 4000 damage per Angel (including the first hit and the following 3 rounds). With the match over, I still had full health.
As soon as I switched over to Life, I couldn't be beat. :( No more challenge.
Once again, give it time, people need to adjust to the new settings and come up with a good strategy. I will give a few strategies at the end, to prove you are not as powerful as you think you are!
Of course I went up against another Ice Wizard once, and we both "spam healed." The match lasted 40 minutes before she got bored, gave up, and fled. It could have easily lasted for an hour or more, as we both had Reshuffle. And in PvP, no mana is consumed in the casting of any spells, so there was no real time limit, and no real end in sight.
And we both had the Life Amulet.
Okay, first off, Fire, with Blade, Pet Blade, Treasure Blade, Balance Blade, Elemental Blade, Treasure Elemental Blade, & WildFire, used with a Full Pip Heck Hound with gargantuan! Then Go Critical on that, which you probably wont even need to, see how well you can live through that! Even with your shield, then cast fire elf if you spam shielded. And to prevent you from blading too much, have myth as secondary school with amulet and earthquake your blades, not so powerful anymore, now are you?
Secondly, Balance, with feint, amulet feint, treasure feint, and pet feint, with balance blade, pet blade, and treasure balance blade! Then use Judgment with gargantuan, shouldn't even need to critical, but if it does, you are finished by a mile and a half. Do the math, your good at it! Balance does not even need the new amulet!
Storm, Storm hound, and Gargantuan WildBolts with Vengeance! Need I say more?
------------
Then there is Team PvP, which I admittedly do not play due to the tactics of Earthquake (EQ) Stun.
With the introduction of these Amulets, this tactic will be easily abused... Until, of course, KI fixes it so that EQ no longer removes Stun Blocks.
But as it stands...
In order to have a regular 42 Level Spell in your main deck (meaning non-treasure: Hydra, Centaur, Earthquake, Wraith, Helephant, Colossus, or Stormzilla), you will have to use your training points all the way in a non-primary school. If you do this, it is commonly referred to as your "secondary school," because you really don't have any training points left over to significantly train in a third school.
I can see a 4v4 team being made up of Storm-Myth, Ice-Myth, and Myth-Whatever, with the 4th player as you so choose but with Myth secondary.
1st Round) Stun All 2nd Round) EQ, Stun All 3rd Round) EQ, Lord or Giant 4th Round) EQ, Giant or Lord And so on....
Add Treasure Cards, and this pattern can easily be used. It all depends on who gets to cast the First Stun All spell.
I can not argue about the chain stunning, they are or will be a problem, but give KI time, they will give a stun arua or stop letting earthquake remove stun shields!
------------
I have a few ideas that could allow the use of power pips for off-school spells, but take away the constant effect that the Amulets currently provide.
Possible Solutions
1) Amulet gives 3 or 4 Auras that each last 4 rnds giving access to power pips to a specific alternate school.
2) Amulet gives 4 or 5 blades that each give access to power pips to a specific alternate school.
3) Amulet gives 5 or 6 Sun School type spells that can be attached to another spell (like Keen Eyes or Gargantuan) which converts the spell into one's main school, thus giving access to power pips for that spell. However, once attached, no other Sun type spell can be attached.
4) And this is just a wild idea: A polymorph spell that transforms you into a different school for 6 rounds, but doesn't change your spell deck like the other Polymorph spells do.
There is a trade off in each of these ideas, which lends a more balanced application of the idea to access power pips for an alternate school. Example, while the Life School Aura is active, you can't have a Fortify, Amplify, or Vengeance Aura; the Blades are expended upon use; the Sun type spells are permanently attached for the duration of the battle; yet they are all returned upon a Reshuffle. ------------
Molly SilverRiver --Legnendary Balance (Ice to Tower Shield, Death up to Feint), Commander Digby DreamCloud --Legnendary Ice (Death up to Feint), Warlord
As for your ideas, they might have been good, but the amulets are already on sale and I don't think that KI can take them back or change them since they are being sold for cash(crowns)! They are advertised as such and purchased as such, so I doubt any changes will be made to them!
As an Ice Wizard with such high resistance, I can fully heal after a Storm Wizard hits me with a fully loaded Leviathan. So my strategy became: blade as able, Fortify, Tower Shield, treasure Gargantuan on Snow Angel, and HEAL. Once I was at full power pips, I had tons of blades and cast 2 Snow Angels back to back each doing over 4000 damage per Angel (including the first hit and the following 3 rounds). With the match over, I still had full health.
This perfectly sums up my fears with the life mastery amulet passing over to pvp. weak attacks are no longer a characteristic of any schools as everyone can spam blade and kill with one hit so the choice becomes clear, use the character with the most health and the best resistance and the life amulet will let you easily heal off damage while you finish your opponent. The easy choice will turn into the popular choice obviously. This so called strategy of blade heal kill will be used by most legendary wizards and I predict and the life amulet will become the old wild bolt. I could be wrong but time will tell the story.
Entangle is no longer an effective way to combat this healing as everyone now has life-force blades and can wand off the dispel. Crafted ring and Athame cancel out infections ability to reduce healing by 50%. There will be people that can "somewhat" hold their ground against a "hard" Ice player but not many. Makes me wonder if this is all part of ki's plan? I'm going to try to form some solid strategies in the meantime but the thought of this makes me want to either create an Ice wizard or drop out of a fight when I see a blue wizard with a green orb.
Adeptus wrote: "Of course I went up against another Ice Wizard once, and we both "spam healed." The match lasted 40 minutes before she got bored, gave up, and fled. It could have easily lasted for an hour or more, as we both had Reshuffle. And in PvP, no mana is consumed in the casting of any spells, so there was no real time limit, and no real end in sight.
And we both had the Life Amulet." ----------------------------------- My Reply: Clearly one area that I would like to see changed at some date in the future. I have always felt that at some point, there should be a time limit in PvP. Lets say after 1.5 hours, they just end the match and it's a draw, no lost on the record, things just stay as they are and both get so many tickets.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ TravisAK wrote: I'm going to try to form some solid strategies in the meantime but the thought of this makes me want to either create an Ice wizard or drop out of a fight when I see a blue wizard with a green orb. -----------------------------------
My Reply: Travis, Form those solid strategies and don't back out of a fight with an Ice. They can be beat just like anyone else, just set them up with Treasure cards. Just use Fire Elf, Earthquake, etc to remove his shields.
One suggestion, find someone that is Ice, has the new Life Amulet and can PvP fairly well. Then go to someone's Castle PvP and practice, and work out your Strategy. This is what I am doing, and it can correct what you expect, before you get in the real PvP battle. (Good luck).
they are there to let you use power pips of other schools
for example yes you would be able to do earthquake then dragon but you would be left with no pips
allowing your oppent the same opportunity and with healing amulets you would or should be able to heal through the dragon.
also by having the amulet you still dont get the schools spells example a myth would earthquake then would judge this cant happen unless the myth uses a treasure card judge.
i see the amulets being a weakness to balance wizards most of all beacause they dont really need other class spells except for
1. tower shield 2. feint .3 Heals
so the only amulet of any use to the balance would be the life amulet while the other schools are going to get a different school amulet.
if i am wrong please explain? am i the only balance wizard on this idea? or is this the common thought of all balance wizards??
they are there to let you use power pips of other schools
for example yes you would be able to do earthquake then dragon but you would be left with no pips
allowing your oppent the same opportunity and with healing amulets you would or should be able to heal through the dragon.
also by having the amulet you still dont get the schools spells example a myth would earthquake then would judge this cant happen unless the myth uses a treasure card judge.
i see the amulets being a weakness to balance wizards most of all beacause they dont really need other class spells except for
1. tower shield 2. feint .3 Heals
so the only amulet of any use to the balance would be the life amulet while the other schools are going to get a different school amulet.
if i am wrong please explain? am i the only balance wizard on this idea? or is this the common thought of all balance wizards??
I think your basically correct, most schools will have the Life Amulet, while Life will almost always have the Myth for Earthquake (or in some cases the Storm Amulet). I can see where the Myth Amulet will be very handy in PvP, just as the Life Amulet. I also can see Balance using the Life Amulet, as those Wizards really need it after using the Judge, and being left with no pips. It will make PvP a bit more Complex, but many won't be able to buy them. So, as it always is, those with the Crowns can gain the advantage in PvP.
Quote from Darthjt: "With the new amulets that will be released soon, there will be a whole new dimension to the game, that will change PvP forever! "
After Darthjt stated this, my brother and I started talking it over. Here was just the very first part of our conversation.......
Imagine this: A Storm Wizard that can heal almost as fast as Life, with crafted gear. It can hit you like a rock, and you can't kill them unless with a one hit ko.
A Myth that can take off your shields and can push a Judgement just about as hard as Balance, with Crafted gear.
A life that can hit just about as hard as Storm with Crafted gear.
An Ice with Storm, Fire or Balance that can hit you with whatever they want, after you get your -70 Ice Shields up in place.
A Fire Wizard that can use Earthquake just like a Myth Wizard does, and then hit you with Dragon the next round.
A Death Wizard that can ready with a hard hit, and then Skeleton Dragon.
A Balance that has Blades already to use for any school and can now use them with a secondary school, plus the schools blade for added hit.
We had lots of thoughts after this, but I will stop here...... So, I can see a whole new Wizard101 just around the corner....
Joe, Joseph LionHunter.
I agree these amulets are about the kryptonite of this game's balanced PvP. I'm afraid this may be the end of PvP ... until we can farm those amulets at Wintertusk.
